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I saw a really good friend this weekend who’s owned a bunch of retail stores. He told me he had to stop hiring female salespeople. The reason? Eventually, one of the male salespeople would hit on one of them, or say something to one of them that could be considered inappropriate, and there was just too much danger that the business would get sued for sexual harassment. This is even though female salespeople are fantastic in his business and do a great job, and even though he personally lectured the male salespeople that the first one who said one thing out of line would be fired.
And there you have the results of the Liberal victimocracy. Teaching people to think of themselves as victims results in more, rather than less, hardship for them—in some cases making it literally dangerous to hire them.
The answer is to teach people to be strong, not weak; to teach people to stand up for themselves, not to consider themselves victims; to teach people to make their workplace stronger, and not to attack it with lawsuits.
#2The time and expense required to defend a lawsuit successfully is quite high. Not to mention the stress about the outcome. Being safe from an unfavorable judgment is not enough.
#3I completely understand your friends point of view. I'm a woman and was a bartender for four years before that I was a waitress in the same bar. I've heard some of the worst comments you can think of, but my boss always supported us when someone went too far. Still some women I worked with threatened to sue. People need be rational and not get sue happy. It is unfortunate he has had to take such drastic measures to protect himself.
#4It's interesting that his response to the men's misbehavior was to discriminate against women.
#5True Tom descrimination is always a bad thing but how do you find a fair balance between employee's rights and employer's rights. I've seen what a sexual harrassement suet can do to a small bussiness even when the employer has done everything right(had no tolerance policy,followed it,etc.) it can damn near bankrupt a small bussiness with court costs and damage to the reputation of the owner and bussiness. I don't know the answer.
#6There may be genuine examples of employers who have suffered despite "doing everything right." But the guy described above has chosen to violate federal law with his employment policies and has zero credibility.
#7Why do you mean by your statement that he has "zero credibility"?
#8I mean his claim that he "had to" stop hiring women is not credible when his male employees are the troublemakers.
#9"...there was just too much danger that the business would get sued for sexual harassment. "
What he said is factually correct. It's already known to be true.
#10Why did he stop hiring women rather than stop hiring men? By his own admission, the men were the problem.
#11>Why did he stop hiring women rather than stop hiring men?
You haven't responded to the point. He did so because “...there was just too much danger that the business would get sued for sexual harassment.“
#12If he stopped hiring men -- you know, the ones who were responsible for the sexual harassment in the first place -- wouldn't that remove the danger that the business would get sued for sexual harassment?
#13Your solution to the injustice discribed by my friend is for businesses to stop hiring men; that is not a serious suggestion.
#14Please explain to me why his solution -- not hiring women -- is better.
#15Men don't sue for sexual harassment.
#16There is an interesting article at http://www.backlash.com/book/sexhar.html that discusses this topic. Give it a read. I think it demonstrates the problem quite well.
#17Thanks for posting this great link. And, BTW, cool Gravatar!
#18Men don’t sue for sexual harassment.
A most revealing answer... and exactly what I expected. Thanks.
#19Revealing how? That in trying to create equal rights in the work place we've gone to far? I am a woman and believe sexual harassment can be a serious crime. The law has become very subjective and can be determined by what some women feel. The definition of sexual harassment is ever expanding therefore leaving employers(especially male employers)increasingly vunerable. In order to be effective a law must be equally defined and enforced. It is much easier for a woman to sue for sexual harassment than a man. Giving too much power to one group leads to abuse of the justice system.
#20That in trying to create equal rights in the work place we’ve gone to far?
Vik's friend isn't interested in creating equal rights in the workplace. He's interested in discriminating against women.
#21Vik’s friend isn’t interested in creating equal rights in the workplace. He’s interested in discriminating against women.
A personal remark such as that, appears to indicate that you have no actual arguments to make in support of your position.
#22I was speaking of society as a whole Tom. Vik's friend's situation is just a symptom of the real problem, which I've already identified.
#23A personal remark such as that, appears to indicate that you have no actual arguments to make in support of your position.
Heh. Isn't THAT a personal remark?
My position is that your friend is the problem. There are all kinds of things a business can get sued for. The fact that he's so worried about sexual harassment in particular suggests that he's created an environment which allows sexual harassment.
#24A bussiness can be sued for many things, however, most things are not so subjective. For example, a slip and fall suit is easily prevented with a wet floor sign. Sexual harassment suit is not so easily avoided due to the nature of how claims are identified. An employer being worried about such claims does not mean he has create an environment which allows sexual harassment.
Even running small businesses, there are ways to protect the business from that sort of suit (it sounds like he's already doing most of it). Having a zero tolerance policy on the books and enforcing it makes it a) much less likely that you will be sued, and b) almost certainly safe from an infavorable judgement. I understand your friend's anciness (nobody wants to be sued), but I think he's overreacting.